I am excited to announce the second version of P2P platform ratings - this time I used not only “feelings“ to assign colors, but also some questions to check, if platform is regulated, transparent, trustworthy and so on. All questions are divided in 2 parts:
Although In my humble opinion ,Iuvo shouldn't be at the same level as Crowdestor and Crowdestate, as Iuvo doesn't get good rate in parts that are not critical unlike the high yield platforms.
Could you please do the same with, Peerberry, Viventor, Grupeer and Bondster? I am invested on these and I am planing to keep a small part of my crowdlending portfolio on these platforms
Thank you for suggestions! Of course, rating is not perfect and actually you could easily copy/paste the table and adjust it to your own view, for example - remove items that you don't find important.
nice work Im sharing on our local forum , what about the others p2p platforms like peerbery, viainvest , swaper .... not interested ? btw Jorgen approves ROFL
Will add these as well, but wanted to start with a bit serious approach first (when comparing to my Feb ratings) and go through platforms that I already mentioned or had recently looked at.
Also Grupeer, Bondster, Robocash, Viventor, Bulkestate, Housers... in particular Grupeer in this period...
Also my two cents, hopefully to give my contribution:
1) with Twino you can sell back your loans, so I think you can put 2points in secondary market.
2) Also they are never frozen, except for Payback Guarantee in default, they are pay back regularly but you can't sell them back
3) well, I tried to sell back several loans, with Twino, Mintos, Bondora and Crowdestate, without bonus (nor discount) I sell everything in 1 day. Never tried the others.
4) Iuvo has buyback guarantee, without interests, but capitals has buyback
5) well, fastinvest is not overcomplicated.. I think it is quite simple.. not more complicated then the others..
6) sudden change in terms... TFGcrowd never change their terms, they never provide exit strategy or sellback and they have honored each withdrawal on time, normally 1 business day, it is one of the fastest
7) hiding critical info: I think also Crowdestor, they work normally (not always, but usually) with SPV under Janis Timma... the older agreements were more transparent then the actual ones.
8) Guarantee that make no sense: I think you need to put -1 to TFGCrowd, the strategy is the same of Crowdestor... I know this kind of Guarantee is ridiculous, but it is not as wisefund, envestio, etc...
You did a good job in the first posts you made to try and expose bad P2P platforms.
But I must say that now you start to do lists with not good enough reaserch and I dont know what your after since you also took out a creditcard loan to invest in P2P, that in it self shows lack of judgment in the world on investing. You are becomeing a person new lenders try to follow but if you have to ask them for pointers before creating lists and as I said, dont even have money to invest yourself so you take loans to get a profit of 50-75Euros how can you defend that?
Thank you for feedback! The first list was almost a joke (took me 1h), but in my opinion - still better/more accurate than any other P2P platform rating I've seen so far. I have a very critical view of 99% of P2P blogs, who do these lists, monthly portfolio updates etc. and all together create huge damage - in tens of millions of EUR, that will be lost by dumb investors. So I am trying to undo/limit this damage in some sense by creating my own ratings and doing my own reviews - hopefully providing a different, more critical view and raising some questions that others don't.
Talking about the loan I took - if it was not clear in that post, it is done for fun and more with a goal to show how stupid it is, not to make money. I invest in P2P myself, my current P2P portfolio is about 25k EUR (not counting that 3k loan), and P2P is only a small part of my investments. In future I plan to write more about other investments as well - stocks, crypto, etc., but now focus is more on P2P, because this whole ecosystem is so fucked up and needs some cleaning.
Right now - only EstateGuru, but consider playing around with Mintos secondary market to buy discounted loans from Delfin, IuteCredit, Mogo. And Viainvest,twino,peerberry, robo.cash seem ok so far - have not changed rules for investors or done any big fuckups as others.
If you have time, do please have a look at Trine. It would be great if they got a good rating and would perhaps encourage people to invest in a decidedly green crowdlending scheme!
i have zero actual info, just obvious questioning about Twino (and maybe Im wrong but): its known that they finance only their own LO, money keeps coming in and builds pressure for keeping rapid growth-for that you need to be more agressive to get more borrowers. Recently was Kazakhstan market open-and all new markets will be risky countries. Risk is in the fact that this is one owner business and Twino is tool of borrowing money for low interest for their other business with high interest loans. its not the concept of p2p, its one company borrowing money
for its business expansion. obviously, some quarter of loans are never paid back, but sharkloan % business earns enough to promise buyback guarantee. Yes, this could be unreasonable, its not a ponzi, but it can also be really beautiful house of cards. If loans are not paid back massively, who will guarantee buy back guarantees? Viainvest same model.
Hi, thank you! Don't plan to review payment solutions, but from first impression - looks good - operating 10+ years, has raised VC capital (they should do DD), used by October and raised $25M last year - so should have no issue with operations even if revenue goes down because of covid crisis.
Can you add Viventor, Swaper, Bondster, Peerberry, EstateGuru, Finbee and/or Robo.cash.
I mean CrowdEstate instead of EstateGuru (which was already listed).
great job Kristaps Mors.
Although In my humble opinion ,Iuvo shouldn't be at the same level as Crowdestor and Crowdestate, as Iuvo doesn't get good rate in parts that are not critical unlike the high yield platforms.
Could you please do the same with, Peerberry, Viventor, Grupeer and Bondster? I am invested on these and I am planing to keep a small part of my crowdlending portfolio on these platforms
Thanks!
Thank you for suggestions! Of course, rating is not perfect and actually you could easily copy/paste the table and adjust it to your own view, for example - remove items that you don't find important.
My suggestion is to check out Grupeer and Peerberry.
Thank you!
Very useful work, Kristaps, thank you! But you have a very tight sieve. Relentless evaluation :-)
Thank you!
Hi again
nice work Im sharing on our local forum , what about the others p2p platforms like peerbery, viainvest , swaper .... not interested ? btw Jorgen approves ROFL
Will add these as well, but wanted to start with a bit serious approach first (when comparing to my Feb ratings) and go through platforms that I already mentioned or had recently looked at.
Also Grupeer, Bondster, Robocash, Viventor, Bulkestate, Housers... in particular Grupeer in this period...
Also my two cents, hopefully to give my contribution:
1) with Twino you can sell back your loans, so I think you can put 2points in secondary market.
2) Also they are never frozen, except for Payback Guarantee in default, they are pay back regularly but you can't sell them back
3) well, I tried to sell back several loans, with Twino, Mintos, Bondora and Crowdestate, without bonus (nor discount) I sell everything in 1 day. Never tried the others.
4) Iuvo has buyback guarantee, without interests, but capitals has buyback
5) well, fastinvest is not overcomplicated.. I think it is quite simple.. not more complicated then the others..
6) sudden change in terms... TFGcrowd never change their terms, they never provide exit strategy or sellback and they have honored each withdrawal on time, normally 1 business day, it is one of the fastest
7) hiding critical info: I think also Crowdestor, they work normally (not always, but usually) with SPV under Janis Timma... the older agreements were more transparent then the actual ones.
8) Guarantee that make no sense: I think you need to put -1 to TFGCrowd, the strategy is the same of Crowdestor... I know this kind of Guarantee is ridiculous, but it is not as wisefund, envestio, etc...
Ciao,
Emanuele
Thank you for detailed feedback! Will go over these points when I do the next update
Viainvest, Lendermarket and Swaper please <3
You did a good job in the first posts you made to try and expose bad P2P platforms.
But I must say that now you start to do lists with not good enough reaserch and I dont know what your after since you also took out a creditcard loan to invest in P2P, that in it self shows lack of judgment in the world on investing. You are becomeing a person new lenders try to follow but if you have to ask them for pointers before creating lists and as I said, dont even have money to invest yourself so you take loans to get a profit of 50-75Euros how can you defend that?
Thank you for feedback! The first list was almost a joke (took me 1h), but in my opinion - still better/more accurate than any other P2P platform rating I've seen so far. I have a very critical view of 99% of P2P blogs, who do these lists, monthly portfolio updates etc. and all together create huge damage - in tens of millions of EUR, that will be lost by dumb investors. So I am trying to undo/limit this damage in some sense by creating my own ratings and doing my own reviews - hopefully providing a different, more critical view and raising some questions that others don't.
Talking about the loan I took - if it was not clear in that post, it is done for fun and more with a goal to show how stupid it is, not to make money. I invest in P2P myself, my current P2P portfolio is about 25k EUR (not counting that 3k loan), and P2P is only a small part of my investments. In future I plan to write more about other investments as well - stocks, crypto, etc., but now focus is more on P2P, because this whole ecosystem is so fucked up and needs some cleaning.
Can you also share which platforms you use personally?
Right now - only EstateGuru, but consider playing around with Mintos secondary market to buy discounted loans from Delfin, IuteCredit, Mogo. And Viainvest,twino,peerberry, robo.cash seem ok so far - have not changed rules for investors or done any big fuckups as others.
Hope you find time for an update, I find this very insightful and useful!
Can you review Reinvest24 and Bulkestate?
Please review Moncera. I like your blog!
EstateGuru showed a fat -€533k loss for 2019. Quite worrying, to put it mildly...
If you have time, do please have a look at Trine. It would be great if they got a good rating and would perhaps encourage people to invest in a decidedly green crowdlending scheme!
What about Swaper and Adlrate.com?
i have zero actual info, just obvious questioning about Twino (and maybe Im wrong but): its known that they finance only their own LO, money keeps coming in and builds pressure for keeping rapid growth-for that you need to be more agressive to get more borrowers. Recently was Kazakhstan market open-and all new markets will be risky countries. Risk is in the fact that this is one owner business and Twino is tool of borrowing money for low interest for their other business with high interest loans. its not the concept of p2p, its one company borrowing money
for its business expansion. obviously, some quarter of loans are never paid back, but sharkloan % business earns enough to promise buyback guarantee. Yes, this could be unreasonable, its not a ponzi, but it can also be really beautiful house of cards. If loans are not paid back massively, who will guarantee buy back guarantees? Viainvest same model.
PeerBerry and Swaper. Please.
Hello.
Your Blog is different ;)
I would like to ask about Lemon Way (https://www.lemonway.com/en/). Some P2P-companies use it. Is it really safe?
Best regards
Hi, thank you! Don't plan to review payment solutions, but from first impression - looks good - operating 10+ years, has raised VC capital (they should do DD), used by October and raised $25M last year - so should have no issue with operations even if revenue goes down because of covid crisis.